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In continuation with the excerpts from The Four Agreements, by Don Miguel Ruiz, here is the second agreement. This is one we have all heard and maybe even said many times, but I think it bares reminder and examination. I have included some of the text that made the most sense to me.

Don't Take Anything Personally

Nothing others do is because of you. What others say and do is a projection of their own reality, their own dream. When you are immune to the opinions of others, you won't be the victim of needless suffering.

Even when a situation seems so personal, even if others insult you directly, it has nothing to do with you. What they say, what they do, and the opinions they give are according to the agreements they have in their own minds. Their point of view comes from all the programing they received during [childhood].
If someone gives you an opinion and says, "Hey, you look so fat," don't take it personally, because the truth is that this person is dealing with his or her own feelings, beliefs, and opinions. That person tried to send poison to you and if you take it personally, then you take that poison and it becomes yours.
When you take things personally, then you feel offended, and your reaction is to defend your beliefs and create conflicts. You make something big out of something so little, because you have the need to be right by giving them your own opinions. In the same way, whatever you feel and do is just a projection of your own agreements. What you say, what you do and the opinions you have are according to the agreements you have made – and these opinions have nothing to do with me.
You may even tell me, "What you are saying is hurting me." But it is not what I am saying that is hurting you; it is that you have wounds that I have touched by what I have said. You are hurting yourself. There is no way that I can take this personally. Not because I don't believe in you or don't trust you, but because I know that you see the world with different eyes, with your eyes. You create an entire picture or movie in your mind, and in that picture you are the director, you are the producer, you are the main actor or actress. Everyone else is a secondary actor or actress. It is your movie.

Date: 2005-01-07 06:31 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] aiglet.livejournal.com
While I agree with the sentiment (that you shouldn't try to own other people's baggage), I think that there's a fundamental problem with this sort of outlook, in that it tends to lead to people refusing to be responsible for the consequences of their actions. (NB: In no way do I mean to suggest that you're going to take it that way, or that anyone else we know will, I'm just exploring the idea of the misuse of things like this.)

For example:
If I tell Mary that she looks fat, and it hurts her feelings, even though she may be being hurt because she's a recovering anorexic, don't I own some responsibility for her pain because I caused it? Or at least the responsibility for having been less-than-tactful to her about something?

If someone hurts my feelings, don't I have a right to be upset with them for doing something that hurt me (especially if they did it on purpose)?

The view that's described above seems to imply that the answer to both those questions is "no" -- it's the fault and responsibility of the person who was hurt for allowing themselves to be affected by other people. Yet we're designed to be social creatures, and socialized to allow other people's comments to affect how we act and speak in public -- that's how societies are created and hang together.

There's a line somewhere that exists between "owning your own problems and no one else's" and "taking adequate and appropriate responsibility for what you do and say to other people" that's really hard to pin down.

Date: 2005-01-07 06:55 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] ragani.livejournal.com
If I tell Mary that she looks fat, and it hurts her feelings, even though she may be being hurt because she's a recovering anorexic, don't I own some responsibility for her pain because I caused it? Or at least the responsibility for having been less-than-tactful to her about something?

Taken out of context, sure. But think it is important to remember the first agreement, which is to be impeccable with your word. To quote the author in that chapter:
"You go against yourself when you judge or blame yourself for anything. Being impeccable is not going against yourself. When you are impeccable, you take responsibility for your actions, but you do not judge or blame yourself.
Being impeccable with your word is not using the word against yourself. If I see you in the street and call you stupid, it appears that I'm using the word against you. But in reality I am using the word against myself, because you are going to hate me for this, and you hating me is not good for me. Therefore, if I get angry and with my word send all that emotional poison to you, I'm using the word against myself."

So, in keeping the first agreement in mind, you are responsible for using the word to attempt to poison Mary. And it is up to Mary to accept that poison. There are two people in that exchange, and you are both responsible for your actions. If you are keeping with the first agreement, you would not have said it in the first place, or at least not with the intention of hurting Mary's feelings.

Date: 2005-01-07 06:57 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] zhaneel69.livejournal.com
Thanks for saying some of what was on my mind.

I do think people need to take responsibility for owning what they do. Frex: Having FanBoy tell me he doesn't love me would hurt like hell. That's personal. And there is no way, given an assumption of intelligence, for him to believe at this time that it wouldn't hurt me. He would need to own the responsibility for causing that pain, even if it was a truthful statement.

As for not taking things personally, I think it is more akin to Ferret's recent post on dark meat. Instead of assuming that everyone remembers everything about you and getting mad when they don't do what you think they should, accept that you are not the center of everyone's world. That, I think, says it better.

Frex (again): Over Xmas shopping FanBoy got very tired & cranky. He had told me and I accepted that but didn't understand it fully. Due to his exhaustion he made a mistake and I yelled at him because, in my centric worldview, I had damn well told him not to do that beforehand. We both took it personally that the other didn't remember what we'd told them and therefore do what we wanted them to do. We both decided that obviously "MY" needs/status should be the center of "YOUR" basis for action. Bad us.

Zhaneel
From: [identity profile] ragani.livejournal.com
Yeah, I would feel lousy if [livejournal.com profile] abditus told me he did not love me, but I know intellectually that it is my fear of not being lovable making me feel that way. If I let go of my fear of not being lovable, and focused on loving myself, that fear would vanish. Since one of the issues in my life is getting better control of my anger, it looks like I should be focusing on letting go of the fears that drive the anger.
In addition to the comments and excerpts about the first agreement in my reply to [livejournal.com profile] aiglet, here are some more excerpts from the chapter on the second agreement that I think are relevant your comments:

Personal importance, or taking things personally, is the maximum expression of selfishness because we make the assumption that everything is about "me." During the period of our education, or our domestication, we learn to take everything personally. We thing we are responsible for everything. Me, me, me always me.
Your point of view is something personal to you. It is not one's truth but yours. Then, if you get mad at me, I know you are dealing with yourself. I am the excuse for you to get mad. And you get mad because you are afraid, because you are dealing with fear. If you are not afraid, there is not way you will hate me. If you are not afraid, there is not way you will be jealous or sad.
Whatever people do, feel, think or say, don't take it personally. If they tell you how wonderful you are, they are not saying that because of you. You know you are wonderful. It is not necessary to believe other people who tell you that you are wonderful. Don't take anything personally. Even if someone got a gun a shot you in the head, it was nothing personal. Even at the extreme.
From: [identity profile] zhaneel69.livejournal.com
I have a really hard time accepting that NOTHING is EVER personal.

It is not something I think I am capable of and from what you are excerpting it is not something I want to try to do.

It is not my fear of not being lovable that would upset me if FanBoy told me he didn't love me. It would be the fact that a man I love and have devoted myself to no longer feels that way for me. I can love myself all I want. I still need/desire love from others. Loving myself doesn't make hurt/pain/anger at not being loved by someone else go away. At least not in my experience.

Zhaneel

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